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Poll

I prefer to watch a Studio Ghibli film...

In it's original Japanese with subtitles.
21 (61.8%)
Dubbed into English.
7 (20.6%)
It really doesn't matter.
6 (17.6%)

Total Members Voted: 34

Author Topic: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese  (Read 11423 times)

Teproc

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #30 on: July 08, 2015, 02:38:38 PM »
I don't ever watch anything dubbed.

Same here, and I don't see why animated movies should be any different. It's obviously more tolerable to watch a dubbed animated movie because you don't suffer the sound/image disconnect, but on principle, I believe movies should be watched as the artist intended, which is in their original language.
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Monty

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #31 on: July 08, 2015, 03:30:35 PM »
Werner Herzog in the dubbed version of The Wind Rises :o was a little off-putting. Also it must be said that a lot of the target audience for Studio Ghibli may be kids...sorry young adults, which may explain the dubbed versions.


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1SO

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #32 on: July 08, 2015, 03:45:23 PM »
Herzog in The Wind Rises was genius. As brilliant as Michael Keaton in Porco Rosso.

I find that Disney/Pixar has put a lot of care into the casting and recording of the voices. I watch Ghibli films more for the imagery than the voice work. Subtitles cover some of the image, and the overall effect is like a magazine cover with that subscription address marring the composition. I don't believe the artist intended for that either.

Teproc

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #33 on: July 08, 2015, 03:57:21 PM »
Well, wouldn't that argument hold for live-action movies as well ? Certainly there are live-action films that are more notable for their imagery than their performances.

Part of it seems to be that voice-over performances don't seem to be considered as such, which I don't agree with. I could see saying that both have value precisely because dubbed offers other performances, but at that point I would almost consider it as an alternative version of the movie.
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1SO

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #34 on: July 08, 2015, 04:06:47 PM »
Considering I don't speak Japanese, it's presumptive to say the subtitled version holds truer to the original vocal performance. I'd just be judging by the sounds as I know them to relate to English. Doesn't that also create an alternate version of the movie? (Insert Certified Copy argument.)

Teproc

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #35 on: July 08, 2015, 04:23:16 PM »
Considering I don't speak Japanese, it's presumptive to say the subtitled version holds truer to the original vocal performance.

Well, it is the original vocal performance, so I'm not sure what you mean here. I also don't know how that's unique to animated movies, but I assume you don't feel the same way about foreign-language live-action movies.

P.S. : I have not seen Copie Conforme/Certified Copy yet, but if the argument is that you'll perceive the performance differently because you don't speak Japanese, I'd argue that no one perceives performance in exactly the same way anyway. So by that definition, every movie has infinite alternate versions, one for each person watching it.
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Paul Phoenix

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #36 on: July 08, 2015, 04:33:10 PM »
Original with subtitles. I prefer to watch anime with their original voices than the dubbed ones because I want to see what the original artist had intended with his work, not what some dubber thinks how the voices should sound like (or what the dialogues should be, for that matter; dubbers change dialogues sometimes for the sake of 'translation').
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1SO

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #37 on: July 08, 2015, 05:34:59 PM »
Considering I don't speak Japanese, it's presumptive to say the subtitled version holds truer to the original vocal performance.

Well, it is the original vocal performance, so I'm not sure what you mean here.
What we take to be the "original vocal performance" is actually our ears and brain decoding that performance to match the words on the screen. We hope that we're getting the inflection to match up, but it's really our take on that combination of sound and word, and not as pure and true as subtitle purists (dub snobs) like to believe.

I also don't know how that's unique to animated movies, but I assume you don't feel the same way about foreign-language live-action movies.
It's not, and twice now you've tried to apply my argument outside of Studio Ghibli, which is the debate on this table. I almost always watch foreign language films with subtitles, but while I have no argument for subtitling being better or worse than dubbing, when it comes to Studio Ghibli, I often select the dub. I find it to be as acceptable an alternative as any dub I know. You may see it as colorizing black and white films, but if that be the case, these are the best of that bunch to the point where I don't notice something is off and simply get lost in the film. I have more problems with dubbing in Leone's Dollars Trilogy, and those are often done by the actual actors.


every movie has infinite alternate versions, one for each person watching it.
And each version is a work of art unto itself. That is the argument of Copie Conforme/Certified Copy.

Teproc

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #38 on: July 08, 2015, 05:44:36 PM »
To clarify, I'm not trying to distort what you're saying by applying it to works outside the subject at hand, I'm trying to understand why you draw a line between animated and non-animated in that regard. I guess you don't have to have any better reason than "it doesn't bother me in this specific case but it does in others", but I'm interested if there's more than that.
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1SO

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Re: Studio Ghibli: English or Japanese
« Reply #39 on: July 08, 2015, 05:55:23 PM »
Okay. I didn't think you were trying to disagree like a legal loophole. (BTW, I'm loving this discussion.) I grew up with Japanese anime and karate films that were horribly, carelessly dubbed. It gives one a knee-jerk reaction to say that all dubbing is always bad. I've seen that carry over as close to this discussion as Princess Mononoke, which was dubbed under Miramax (though I think some Pixar people were involved.) They took great care in hiring Neil Gaiman to write the translated script, but then they cast actors who were the names (that they could afford) and some of the match-ups don't fit.

Since Lasseter spear-headed the campaign to allow Pixar to handle the English Dubs, I think he's done a very good job treating these films with care. Pete Docter was in charge of Howl's Moving Castle. That is why Studio Ghibli is a specific case where I am fine with the dubbed version.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2015, 05:57:59 PM by 1SO »

 

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