Author Topic: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners  (Read 7090 times)

Jared

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #10 on: March 19, 2014, 11:03:05 AM »
At Berkeley is wonderful. It got my vote in one of the few categories Id seen everything in (and I really liked 4 of those and though Blackfish was decent).


PeacefulAnarchy

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #11 on: March 19, 2014, 11:14:34 AM »
— 43 people voted in the Documentary category. 10 of them saw At Berkeley. 5 of them thought it was better than everything else they saw. (By comparison, 39 voters saw The Act of Killing, and 19 of them voted for it. 3 of those voters had seen none of the other nominees.)

Categories Affected by the Weighting of Votes
     Animated Film - Frozen would have edged out Wolf Children based on a straight-up percentage (60.9% vs. 60.0%)
     Art Direction - Her would have beaten The Grandmaster (44.2% vs. 40.0%)

Act of Killing got 19 votes, At Berkeley got 5... but the Doc category wasn't affected by weighting? How does that work?
At Berkeley won 50% of its voters while Act of Killing only won 48.7% of its voters.
I feel like there's two forms of weighting going on, one for the percentage of its viewers a film won and one for films with fewer viewers and both of those give lesser seen films a bit too much of an advantage, though it's hard to complain when I haven't seen the films in question.

Plus, this
Quote
PeacefulAnarchy   23.5% (4/17)
gives me plenty to complain about. Grumble grumble.

But really, these are some interesting results and I'll try to check out some of the ones I've missed over the coming year.  Thanks for the hard work pixote.

FLYmeatwad

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #12 on: March 19, 2014, 11:15:52 AM »
The fifty minutes I saw of At Berkley were better than the entirety I saw of the other nominees. Couldn't count it for my lists or ballots though because Wiseman is CINECAST!ing insane and it's this four hour thing that was shown at like 10pm one night on PBS. What the CINECAST!!

JakeIsntFake

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2014, 11:25:40 AM »
What a world
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pixote

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2014, 11:49:30 AM »
Categories Affected by the Weighting of Votes
     Animated Film - Frozen would have edged out Wolf Children based on a straight-up percentage (60.9% vs. 60.0%)
     Art Direction - Her would have beaten The Grandmaster (44.2% vs. 40.0%)

Act of Killing got 19 votes, At Berkeley got 5... but the Doc category wasn't affected by weighting? How does that work?
At Berkeley won 50% of its voters while Act of Killing only won 48.7% of its voters.
I feel like there's two forms of weighting going on, one for the percentage of its viewers a film won and one for films with fewer viewers and both of those give lesser seen films a bit too much of an advantage, though it's hard to complain when I haven't seen the films in question.

Right. There are three ways to look at the numbers: 1) The raw vote total (19 votes for The Act of Killing, 5 for At Berkeley; 2) The straight percentage (19/39 = 48.7% for The Act of Killing; 5/9 = 55.6% for At Berkeley; and 3) The weighted percentage (30.1% for The Act of Killing; 45.0% for At Berkeley).

A vote is worth a full 1.00 points if you've seen every nominee in the category; but then it's a sliding scale down to 0.50 points if you've only seen a single nominee in the category. The design here is to encourage people to vote for any nominee they feel is deserving (even if it's the only nominee they've seen) but to keep that from giving the more widely viewed films too much of an advantage; and also to encourage people to catch up with as many of the nominees as possible. It's always a little controversial, but I think it works up pretty well and generally holds up to scrutiny. For example, looking at the subset of voters who saw both At Berkeley and The Act of Killing, 5 voted for At Berkeley, 1 voted for The Act of Killing, 1 voted for Stories We Tell, and 1 voted for Blackfish. That's a small statistical sample, to be sure, but I feel it justifies the end result.

If winners were decided by just raw vote total, they'd look like this:

Picture: 12 Years a Slave
Director: Gravity
Original Screenplay: Her
Adapted Screenplay: Before Midnight
Actor: Leonardo DiCaprio (The Wolf of Wall Street) and Chiwetel Ejiofor (12 Years a Slave) - TIE
Actress: Adèle Exarchopoulos (Blue Is the Warmest Color)
Supporting Actor: James Franco (Spring Breakers)
Supporting Actress: Lupita Nyong'o (12 Years a Slave)
Ensemble Cast: 12 Years a Slave
Non-English Language Film: The Hunt
Animated Film: Frozen
Documentary: The Act of Killing
Editing: Gravity
Sound: Gravity
Score: Upstream Color
Soundtrack: Inside Llewyn Davis
Cinematography: Gravity
Art Direction: Her
Visual Effects: Gravity
Surprise: Spring Breakers
Debut Feature: The Act of Killing
Overlooked Film: Gimme the Loot
Scene (Dramatic): Final Scene (Captain Phillips)
Scene (Comedic): Cerebral Palsy Phase (The Wolf of Wall Street)
Shot: Opening (Gravity)
Line: "Look at my shit!" (Spring Breakers)

pixote
« Last Edit: March 19, 2014, 11:51:39 AM by pixote »
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Junior

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2014, 11:57:22 AM »
I'm always interested in these behind the scenes peeks, even if I, too, reside behind those scenes. I'm also always happy with the results of the Filmspots, though usually not as happy as I could be if you all had as good taste as I have.
Check out my blog of many topics

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PeacefulAnarchy

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2014, 12:24:50 PM »
If winners were decided by just raw vote total, they'd look like this:
I take it the blue ones are the ones that changed and everything else remained the same?
If so I'm actually surprised most of the results are the same either way.

As for the weighting, that's an interesting way to do it. To be clear, I do think weighting is a good idea, just off hand it seems based on the doc and animated results that perhaps the weighting is a little too strong.

Still, even if all the Act of Killing votes were worth 0.5 that would be 9.5 points and if all the At Berkeley votes were full value that would only be 5 points. So I take it there's something else going on as well?

pixote

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2014, 12:29:42 PM »
Still, even if all the Act of Killing votes were worth 0.5 that would be 9.5 points and if all the At Berkeley votes were full value that would only be 5 points. So I take it there's something else going on as well?

The winners are determined by looking at the percentage of each film's total points against that films possibile total points:

Frozen = 14 votes from 23 viewers --> 9.30 points out of a possible 23.00 = 40.4%
Wolf Children  = 6 votes from 10 viewers --> 4.10 points out of a possible 10.00 = 41.0%

Those percentages don't match what's listed in the official results because I normalize each category back to 100% total.

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MartinTeller

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2014, 12:59:32 PM »
The winners are determined by looking at the percentage of each film's total points against that films possibile total points:

Frozen = 14 votes from 23 viewers --> 9.30 points out of a possible 23.00 = 40.4%
Wolf Children  = 6 votes from 10 viewers --> 4.10 points out of a possible 10.00 = 41.0%

But... what you're doing is dividing a weighted numerator by a non-weighted denominator, which further increases the effect of the weighting.  In this example, Frozen is only "out of a possible 23.00" if everyone who saw Frozen also saw all of the other nominees.  Shouldn't it be 9.30 points out of a possible (whatever the weighted number would be if all 23 had voted for Frozen)?

I'm not griping, BTW.  I appreciate the huge amount of work (and math!) you put into this, and having not seen At Berkeley myself, I don't have much room to complain anyway.  It just seems like the weighting is a little too much when a film gets 19 votes but still loses to a film with 5 votes.


I also still don't understand why Documentary wasn't listed under "Categories Affected by the Weighting of Votes"

pixote

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Re: Filmspots 2013: Official Winners
« Reply #19 on: March 19, 2014, 01:06:26 PM »
But... what you're doing is dividing a weighted numerator by a non-weighted denominator, which further increases the effect of the weighting.  In this example, Frozen is only "out of a possible 23.00" if everyone who saw Frozen also saw all of the other nominees.  Shouldn't it be 9.30 points out of a possible (whatever the weighted number would be if all 23 had voted for Frozen)?

Hmm, interesting. Let me play with this when I have more time.

I also still don't understand why Documentary wasn't listed under "Categories Affected by the Weighting of Votes"

Because the result of the straight percentage (votes/viewers) matches the final result (At Berkeley wins either), I don't consider the result to be affected by the weighting of votes. (Rather, it's affected just by the methodology of looking at percentages rather than just vote totals.)

pixote
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