Author Topic: Who Did Atheism Better: 'Sausage Party' or 'The Invention Of Lying'?  (Read 1170 times)

IDrinkYourMilkshake

  • Elite Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1288
  • a souless automaton who can't feel any emotion
Re: Who Did Atheism Better: 'Sausage Party' or 'The Invention Of Lying'?
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2017, 07:00:44 AM »
We're talking about interpretation, so far as I can tell? 

You're saying that:

The point is not to encourage people to live as fully as possible. It's a question he posits once you have already lived at least part of your life. It is not an outlook that determines future actions but a way to experience the moment. Nietzsche wants you to draw ecstasy from the moment, from the act, from the sheer fact of being alive.

I'll go with that, but


What you're doing, how you're doing it is irrelevant. Even if you've had a terrible, horrible life you should be prepared to do it all over again exactly the same way and draw joy and energy from the experience.

Yes, and no. Over to you, Freddy:

Quote from: Friedrich Nietzsche, in 'The Gay Science'
"What if some day or night, a demon were to steal after you in your loneliest loneliness, and say to you: "this life as you now live it, and have lived it, you will have to live once more and innumerable times more, and there will be nothing new in it, but every pain and every joy, and every thought and sigh, and everything unutterably small or great in your life will have to return to you, all in the same succession and sequence. Even this spider, and this moonlight between the trees, even this moment, and I myself. The eternal hourglass of existence is turned upside down, again and again, and you with it, speck of dust."

Would you not throw yourself down, and gnash you teeth and curse the demon who spoke thus? Or have you once experienced a tremendous moment, when you would have answered him: "You are a God, and I never have heard anything more devine".

If this thought gained possession of you, it would change you as you are, or perhaps crush you?
"


The final sentence is the key one. Would the thought of an eternally recurring world change you, or crush you?

Hence, for me, it's about self-creation.


EDIT:

I know that this is not exactly how time in Groundhog Day functions. Murray is able to change things, so it is not an exact representation of the mechanics of the eternal recurrence, but it does represent what Nietzsche was getting at. The point is that Murray, after going through despair and apparent meaninglessness, eventually embraces life.

I'm not saying Nietzsche should have got a credit or anything.

« Last Edit: January 04, 2017, 07:16:54 AM by IDrinkYourMilkshake »
"What should have been an enjoyable 90 minutes of nubile, high-school flesh meeting a frenzy of blood-caked blades, becomes instead an exploitational and complex parable of the conflicting demands of agrarianism and artistry. I voted a miss."

DarkeningHumour

  • Objectively Awesome
  • ******
  • Posts: 10456
  • When not sure if sarcasm look at username.
    • Pretentiously Yours
Re: Who Did Atheism Better: 'Sausage Party' or 'The Invention Of Lying'?
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2017, 10:35:16 AM »
I think you're interpreting that last sentence wrong. Nietzsche is saying that, despite all the awfulness of existence in general, all the spiders and subpar moonlight, if there is a single moment of transcendence in your life you should embrace it and focus on that, not let yourself be crushed by all the surrounding pain. I don't see him advocating a change in future behaviour at all.
Society is dumb. Art is everything. - Junior

https://pretensiouslyyours.wordpress.com/

IDrinkYourMilkshake

  • Elite Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1288
  • a souless automaton who can't feel any emotion
Re: Who Did Atheism Better: 'Sausage Party' or 'The Invention Of Lying'?
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2017, 01:58:03 PM »
Ok, I see what you mean.

I think he's saying both. To have experienced a moment of intense joy (not like that *) can make the rest of it worthwhile. Given that self-creation was a concern of his writing, and a necessary corollary to the whole 'Genealogy of Morals', 'Beyond Good and Evil' stuff, I have to think it also carries the encouragement to self-realise in an effort to experience those moments. So that, when you die, your life won't have been completely joyless. "If the thought took hold of you, it would change you as you are."

It was crucial to undermine traditional ethics, morality, structures of power, in order to 'free' the self.



* INNUENDO
"What should have been an enjoyable 90 minutes of nubile, high-school flesh meeting a frenzy of blood-caked blades, becomes instead an exploitational and complex parable of the conflicting demands of agrarianism and artistry. I voted a miss."

Telegram Sam

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 243
'The Invention Of Lying' Internal Logic Problems
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2017, 08:19:13 PM »
I was frustrated with the sets.
If there is no lying then there is no crime.
"Who did this?"  "Me." Crime solved in honesty land.
The town is full of door locks, car locks and bank wickets.
Anti-crime devices for who?