Poll

Louise Banks (Amy Adams) in Arrival:

had no choice.
8 (66.7%)
is a selfish shit.
4 (33.3%)

Total Members Voted: 12

Author Topic: Arrival  (Read 4380 times)

DarkeningHumour

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #40 on: December 02, 2016, 06:35:22 AM »
Excusing Adams because her daughter may reincarnate is a cop out. The movie doesn't even begin to hint at such possibilities. Interpreting it morally or ethically is one thing, but saying it is okay she suffered  because she gets an extra life is dodging the question.
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DarkeningHumour

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #41 on: December 02, 2016, 06:47:08 AM »
Personally I believe in a soul and in reincarnation, that we keep coming back to evolve. It's only our challenges and suffering that allow us growth. There is also this idea of soul contracts - that certain souls sign on for a more challenging path in order for those around them to make more substantial evolutionary leaps forward.
Does Villeneuve make these ideas apparent?
No, but I like to believe they were on his mind as he made this film and then left it open to some wonderful discussion like this. The viewer is left to insert their own beliefs into their interpretation.
Again, this film, for me at least, was less science fiction and more spiritual.
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verbALs

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #42 on: December 02, 2016, 06:48:59 AM »
In the film   That's Martins own idea a nice one and a nice way to go. Can't ascribe that to the film though.

More straws!!
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DarkeningHumour

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #43 on: December 02, 2016, 06:50:05 AM »
funny how that is exactly what I said.
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verbALs

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #44 on: December 02, 2016, 06:52:11 AM »
Yes you were less than clear about where the thought came from. It is not a cop out in the film.

What you described as the ending doesn't tally with your comment that the film has a poor ending.
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St. Martin the Bald

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #45 on: December 02, 2016, 06:57:53 AM »
Bad things happen in the world, people suffer and die.
Expecting it to not happen or to not find the grains of hope and positivity somewhere in the experience is not how I would want to go through life.
Whether or not he mentioned it (reincarnation) is immaterial because we all color our interpretations of whatever we experience with the filters of our own beliefs.
My ideas were simply me sharing how I interpreted Louise's choice and I found the balance in a very difficult decision.
It worked for me. ;)
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verbALs

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #46 on: December 02, 2016, 07:03:22 AM »
I'd say that knowing the inevitable comclusion would have the positive benefit of cherishing every moment precisely for knowing it's end. It opens up he inevitable thought of our own deaths and those of the people we love and that because death is a very hard thing to stare in the eye we then miss a similar cogniscance to enjoy what we have when we have it. We don't have Louise's advantage in a way. We don't have those "memories"/ images of the future to keep us powered up to cherish our families.

Again I'm enthused that the film can springboard towards these thoughts. Thankfully it never slammed the door on a more philosophical process. Nice afterimages.

I just didn't care at all for these characters either, so that has a lot to do with it.
This is perplexing merely for the film being so much about Adams' Louise that to term it "these characters" misses the point in itself. I feel that by this point Adams primacy as an actor has gone beyond doubt. You could contend with my feeling that she is the best actor working anywhere, confirmed by this film and what she is asked to do; little else I feel.

Renner and Whitaker aren't engaging ? fine. They are in the film but it isn't their film. It's Adams'. I know she interpreted a lot of what Villeneuve was describing to her into facial reaction. That's why it's especially wonderful that she was acting to two tennis balls whilst the director explains what he wanted to convey but Adams is doing the hard work here.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2016, 07:37:32 AM by verbALs »
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Bondo

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #47 on: December 02, 2016, 08:10:14 AM »
I have to admit a certain confusion at the notion that Louise may be morally negligent for having the daughter since she knew the daughter would suffer at the end of her life. It seems the same calculation for Louise applies to the daughter. Maybe it matters her motivation, like if she doesn't have a daughter to avoid her own pain it is selfish but if she does it to avoid her daughter's pain, it is noble. But then if you say she is wrong to not avoid her daughter's pain just for her own joy, similarly it would be wrong to deny her daughter's joy in order to avoid her own pain. This creation of a strong moral bias against any experience of pain/suffering would seem to lead to an advocation of suicide...that it might get better is irrelevant because the good doesn't justify the bad.

verbALs

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #48 on: December 02, 2016, 08:36:08 AM »
I think it is expressed as a personal decision because the father's reaction is to leave Louise and start to look at the daughter differently once he finds out the truth. The truth being that Louise knew all along.

The point you made about suicide is a personal choice rather a moral absolute. Again the assumption that we all die is never expressed in any decision we make is it? Once Louise; like the guy in Slaughterhouse 5, knows the exact moment of death; and it changes her morality. In a sense it doesn't matter to the "time literate" -call it that- whether she or anyone dies at 16 or 80. The question of pain is interssting but it's also modified by prescience. Pain comes to us all. Human condition timey wimey.  ;D
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DarkeningHumour

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Re: Arrival
« Reply #49 on: December 02, 2016, 09:06:02 AM »
I have to admit a certain confusion at the notion that Louise may be morally negligent for having the daughter since she knew the daughter would suffer at the end of her life. It seems the same calculation for Louise applies to the daughter. Maybe it matters her motivation, like if she doesn't have a daughter to avoid her own pain it is selfish but if she does it to avoid her daughter's pain, it is noble. But then if you say she is wrong to not avoid her daughter's pain just for her own joy, similarly it would be wrong to deny her daughter's joy in order to avoid her own pain. This creation of a strong moral bias against any experience of pain/suffering would seem to lead to an advocation of suicide...that it might get better is irrelevant because the good doesn't justify the bad.

You cannot consider both in the same way. Adams already exists. Her daughter does not. Avoiding pain or seeking happiness take different meanings in each case.
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