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Author Topic: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?  (Read 9328 times)

1SO

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Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« on: June 26, 2008, 01:52:32 AM »
I think this discussion might actually benefit by taking place before any of us have seen the actual movie.  That way opinion of the film won't color this discussion.

If Wall-E is indeed as good as its advance buzz, if it is a true artistic achievement and one of the greatest films ever made, does it have a chance at a Best Picture nomination?  Did the Best Animated Film category prevent such a situation from occurring?  Do Animated Films even deserve such consideration?

When Toy Story was released, it received an Special Achievement Oscar.  Even though it was an instant classic and one of the best reviewed films that year, nobody even thought of nominating it for the big prize.  And so it's gone all through Pixar's history.  And while not every Pixar film deserves a Best Picture nomination, I think some of their films are of such high quality, that the lack of a nomination smacks of some form of prejudice.  A computer animated film can't just be Great, it has to somehow be even better if it hopes to be listed as one of the year's 5 Best Pictures.

I think the 5 Best Pictures should be exactly that...the year's 5 Best.  I don't care if they were made in a computer lab, or by a 14-year-old from Finland with Final Cut Pro 1.0 and Adobe After Effects.  The Best should never be brushed off, but every year there seems to be a list of the Top 5 movies, and a different list of the 5 Best Pictures.  (The same prejudice to a smaller extent also applies to the last 3 Harry Potter films.)  Many times last year I heard, "I loved Ratatouille, but I'd never nominate it for Best Picture."  I simply don't understand.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2008, 01:56:20 AM by 1StrongOpinion »

sdedalus

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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2008, 02:12:31 AM »
Beauty And the Beast was nominated for Best Picture, but that was before the Animated Film category.

I don't think there's necessarily an anti-animation bias in the Best Picture nominees.  When did they ever nominate what you thought were actually the five best pictures?
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1SO

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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2008, 02:32:28 AM »
Beauty And the Beast was nominated for Best Picture, but that was before the Animated Film category.

Beauty and The Beast was a touchstone, but I was referring to Computer animation.  I think Pixar has made films that are artistically and technically superior to Beauty.

I don't think there's necessarily an anti-animation bias in the Best Picture nominees.  When did they ever nominate what you thought were actually the five best pictures?

They never nominate anybody's 5 Best.  There's always at least 1 film too out there for the Academy and 1 film too genre.  (I'm thinking of 2006 when MY Top 5 included Inland Empire and The Descent.) 

My argument is that there's a dismissive mindset towards Computer Animation, that no matter how good the film is, it still isn't worth nominating for the Top Prize.

sdedalus

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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2008, 02:34:48 AM »
I don't see why there would be a bias against Computer Animation that wouldn't also encompass Hand-Drawn Animation, if that's what your argument is.
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gateway

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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2008, 03:22:41 AM »
I don't really think the Academy has an inherit bias against computer animation, I think their problem is the perceived (and not entirely deserved) "kiddie" aura of Pixar's films. I actually think Beauty and the Beast is the best of Disney's hand-drawn animated classics, but discounting that, what separated it from much of the rest of Disney's catalog was how "mature" it seemed in comparison. Granted, you had the comic relief of the furniture servants, but if you look at the relationship triangle that forms between Belle, the Beast and Gaston, it's some pretty weighty stuff. I'm not saying that's its a better movie and more Oscar-worthy because of it (I think Pixar has made three movies that all surpassed B&tB, Toy Story, Finding Nemo and The Incredibles), but it's certainly more Academy-friendly, much like how a performance of a noted historical figure with a foreign accent often gets more attention that it likely warrants. The Academy thinks Pixar films are for children, and while they'll probably admit that they are great films, they think they aren't worthy of a Best Picture nod because of that target audience. I think if another animated film is going to follow in Beauty and the Beast's footsteps in the future, it's going to be something in more like Persepolis or the Miyazaki library.

Basically, just copy all the theories on why The Bourne Ultimatum managed to get a lot of love from the Academy last year without a Best Picture nomination, only substitute "too kiddie" with "too action-y."
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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #5 on: June 26, 2008, 06:49:23 AM »
I don't really think the Academy has an inherit bias against computer animation, I think their problem is the perceived (and not entirely deserved) "kiddie" aura of Pixar's films. I actually think Beauty and the Beast is the best of Disney's hand-drawn animated classics, but discounting that, what separated it from much of the rest of Disney's catalog was how "mature" it seemed in comparison. Granted, you had the comic relief of the furniture servants, but if you look at the relationship triangle that forms between Belle, the Beast and Gaston, it's some pretty weighty stuff. I'm not saying that's its a better movie and more Oscar-worthy because of it (I think Pixar has made three movies that all surpassed B&tB, Toy Story, Finding Nemo and The Incredibles), but it's certainly more Academy-friendly, much like how a performance of a noted historical figure with a foreign accent often gets more attention that it likely warrants. The Academy thinks Pixar films are for children, and while they'll probably admit that they are great films, they think they aren't worthy of a Best Picture nod because of that target audience. I think if another animated film is going to follow in Beauty and the Beast's footsteps in the future, it's going to be something in more like Persepolis or the Miyazaki library.

Basically, just copy all the theories on why The Bourne Ultimatum managed to get a lot of love from the Academy last year without a Best Picture nomination, only substitute "too kiddie" with "too action-y."


I think their bias is against animation of all types. Even when Beauty and the Beast was nominated for Best PIcture many believed that there was no chance in hell it was going to win. Shame. In the case of Wall-E, first we have to see if it's actually as good as it looks, and then worry about an Oscar nomination. But I seriously doubt that even if it really is the single best film of the year that it would get nominated for anything higher than Best Screenplay.
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Tequila

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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2008, 07:28:31 AM »
Well...to go back to the initial question (see thread title): No, but to even have a shot it needs to do serious business at the Box Office. This film needs to be a massive hit, maybe even social phenomenon to create some pressure on the Academy.
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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2008, 08:44:04 AM »
I agree with Tequila.

I don't know that we'll ever see another Best Picture nominated animated film ever again.  Beauty and the Beast was leaps and bounds ahead of what Disney had been doing at that point and so was recognized for it.  I think there might be a degree of illegitimacy attached to computer animation in the Academy's eyes.  But with the number of films that have come out since Beauty and the Beast that, IMHO, surpass it in quality - half of Pixar's output, and all of Miyazaki's, for example - I doubt WALL-E will get a Best Picture nod unless it becomes a legitimate worldwide phenomenon that melts even the hardest heart and makes more money than Titanic.  I think it's got a shot at the former but between DVD and torrents, I don't think any movie will outdo Titanic until we hit $20 a ticket.

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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2008, 11:03:50 AM »
I have a feeling based on the advaced buzz that it might get a nomination but since it is a shoe-in to win the Animation Oscar the natural academy tendency to spread the love will prevent a BP win.  It might also get a script nod.

sdedalus

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Re: Can Wall-E Break Through the Oscar Barrier?
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2008, 01:05:13 PM »
Which happens first: a foreign language film wins Best Picture, or an animated film win Best Picture?

My money's on the cartoon.
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