Author Topic: New Moon  (Read 4404 times)

Cirilia

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 73
Re: New Moon
« Reply #30 on: December 03, 2009, 09:05:11 PM »
The correct answer is BttF.

Amen, if only because for women my age and ilk, inappropriate lust for Alex P. Keaton is damn near unflappable.

Just read your critique of New Moon and while I think it's right on in a lot of ways I have to disagree with you on Bella's lack of personality: Bella's tendency to use sarcasm as a coping mechanism (and Kristen Stewart's ability to pull off the occasional dry joke) is something that any fan of Daria or Angela Chase can relate to. It's refreshing to see a heroine who isn't a simpering, wilting cream puff, all sweetness and light 24/7.

I thought the definition of simpering and wilting cream puff included girls who have no will no leave after their vampire boyfriend left them.

Bella unfortunately is today's less well written equivalent gothic heroine of the 18th/19th century. Stripped of Edward's presence, she's pure delicacy (she can't seem to run 3 steps without falling) and passiveness.

Not sure about that--isn't there some agency in her reckless behavior? The more I think about it the more I see parallels between Bella and Jenny from An Education. There is something vicariously thrilling about watching these two young women throw themselves headlong, driven by desire, into a bad decision. I think people should cut both of these women, and their foibles in the face of love (in whatever toxic, wan or misguided form it might take), more slack. 

chardy999

  • Elite Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3551
Re: New Moon
« Reply #31 on: December 03, 2009, 09:06:46 PM »
Comparisons between Bella and Jenny make me angry, no matter how accurate they are.
Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.
- Groucho Marx

FroHam X

  • Objectively Awesome
  • *****
  • Posts: 17792
  • “By any seeds necessary.”
    • justAtad
Re: New Moon
« Reply #32 on: December 03, 2009, 09:36:52 PM »
Just read your critique of New Moon and while I think it's right on in a lot of ways I have to disagree with you on Bella's lack of personality: Bella's tendency to use sarcasm as a coping mechanism (and Kristen Stewart's ability to pull off the occasional dry joke) is something that any fan of Daria or Angela Chase can relate to. It's refreshing to see a heroine who isn't a simpering, wilting cream puff, all sweetness and light 24/7. Yes, she does exhibit some downright frightening obsessive tendencies which are manipulated by the Manvamp she's set her sights on, but there is a subtext of genuine female lust here and that's something Hollywood tends to want to gloss over.

In many ways, I feel like New Moon mirrors An Education, where the person you're really shaking your head at is the adult who should know better. The truth of the matter is, many young women will, and MUST, make these mistakes. Depicting a character who acts irrationally in the face of sexual obsession or the desire for excitement isn't anti-feminist, it's human. I don't think young women are looking up to Bella as much as they're relating to Bella...


Well, I agree, but only in part. My problem with that section of the film is that they push the obsessiveness to a certain unhealthy extreme, and when coupled with the rest of her actions in the film it is hard to see her as anything but a woman who is lifeless without a man. Whereas Jenny in An Education is exploring herself throughout the film and is then taken advantage of, Bella puts herself in a situation where she is not so much taken advantage of than she is allowing the men in her life to be her only important attribute.

And I disagree about Kristen Stewart's ability to pull of dry humour, but that's mostly because she can't pull off anything I'd consider acting to begin with. Certainly not in New Moon.
"We didn't clean the hamster's cage, the hamster's cage cleaned us!"

Can't get enough FroHam? Read more of my musings at justAtad

Marbe

  • Elite Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1541
Re: New Moon
« Reply #33 on: December 03, 2009, 10:44:30 PM »
The correct answer is BttF.

Amen, if only because for women my age and ilk, inappropriate lust for Alex P. Keaton is damn near unflappable.

Just read your critique of New Moon and while I think it's right on in a lot of ways I have to disagree with you on Bella's lack of personality: Bella's tendency to use sarcasm as a coping mechanism (and Kristen Stewart's ability to pull off the occasional dry joke) is something that any fan of Daria or Angela Chase can relate to. It's refreshing to see a heroine who isn't a simpering, wilting cream puff, all sweetness and light 24/7.

I thought the definition of simpering and wilting cream puff included girls who have no will no leave after their vampire boyfriend left them.

Bella unfortunately is today's less well written equivalent gothic heroine of the 18th/19th century. Stripped of Edward's presence, she's pure delicacy (she can't seem to run 3 steps without falling) and passiveness.

Not sure about that--isn't there some agency in her reckless behavior? The more I think about it the more I see parallels between Bella and Jenny from An Education. There is something vicariously thrilling about watching these two young women throw themselves headlong, driven by desire, into a bad decision. I think people should cut both of these women, and their foibles in the face of love (in whatever toxic, wan or misguided form it might take), more slack.  

I think more importantly the difference between Bella and Jenny is Bella is driven by blind devotion and Jenny is driven by desire.

Yes both want to attain the ideal by staying in a risky relationship,

but why I won’t cut Bella any slack is that she never ever assesses the situation. Jenny eventually pursues and confronts herself with the truth, but Bella never stops to ask what she might be giving up to attain being a vampire (even after learning of eternal damnation). And when there’s a chance her romantic plans weren’t going to pan out she becomes almost suicidal which I guess you could call reckless behavior, but her intention seems to me way more desperate than to seek a thrill.

I guess my point is, if you never question anything, you can never learn. Unlike Jenny, Bella never does, the film and fans mistake this as a romantic gesture, but to me it's a character weakness that’s unforgivable.

« Last Edit: December 03, 2009, 10:47:42 PM by Marbegirl »

FroHam X

  • Objectively Awesome
  • *****
  • Posts: 17792
  • “By any seeds necessary.”
    • justAtad
Re: New Moon
« Reply #34 on: December 03, 2009, 10:48:18 PM »
Marbegirl to the rescue.
"We didn't clean the hamster's cage, the hamster's cage cleaned us!"

Can't get enough FroHam? Read more of my musings at justAtad

Cirilia

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 73
Re: New Moon
« Reply #35 on: December 04, 2009, 08:16:09 AM »
Whereas Jenny in An Education is exploring herself throughout the film and is then taken advantage of, Bella puts herself in a situation where she is not so much taken advantage of than she is allowing the men in her life to be her only important attribute.

And I disagree about Kristen Stewart's ability to pull of dry humour, but that's mostly because she can't pull off anything I'd consider acting to begin with. Certainly not in New Moon.

"Taken advantage of" implies the same sort of passivity people decry in Bella, my friend. Jenny was just as obstinately set on her prize as Bella is on her vampire and she engages in all sorts of ugly, weak-willed behavior. She overlooks crime, puts on obnoxious airs, swallows being sternly reprimanded like a child (before the map pilferage) and perhaps worst of all, humiliates her father while he gamely accepts her slimy new fiance.

Please know that I'm totally playing devil's advocate here when it comes to KStew, I think those dry throwaway lines are the ONLY believable bits of her performance; her turn in Adventureland is only slightly more tolerable (hey! another lady thinking with her nether regions...).

Is that offer to write for the Reelist rescinded yet?  ;)

FroHam X

  • Objectively Awesome
  • *****
  • Posts: 17792
  • “By any seeds necessary.”
    • justAtad
Re: New Moon
« Reply #36 on: December 04, 2009, 09:03:09 AM »
Sure, but like I said, to me what it cones down to is that Jenny is exploring herself while Bella is simply throwing it away because she's found a man. Worse yet, when she loses that man her only response is to stop living until yet another man comes around.

And we allow some crazy opinions on TheReelists. We do have FLY as one of our writers. I still don't know how that happened.
"We didn't clean the hamster's cage, the hamster's cage cleaned us!"

Can't get enough FroHam? Read more of my musings at justAtad